What is PAGANISM Part one

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What is PAGANISM Part one

Post by FIRE on June 26th 2009, 3:42 pm

maybe, I the 1st or only pagan here??? So I will share in the hope of enlightening those that don't understand.

Paganism, also known as Witchcraft, is rooted in the collective writings of Gerald Gardner, Margaret Murray, and Robert Graves. Each contributed to the concept of a secretive nature religion, dreamed demonic by medieval Christians, and remembered as covens of witches. Murray brought forth the anthropological theory of a vestigial Diana cult, Graves described a universal Goddess Muse, and Gardner claimed to have been initiated by a Goddess-worshiping witch cult.

Though the work of each of the three people mentioned above have been partially discredited, it has not reduced their collective impact. Instead, sects and perspectives continue to expand and proliferate. Wicca is probably the largest alternative religion in English-speaking countries, as well as the former Soviet Union.

Wicca's popularity can be, in part, ascribed to the apparent hypocrisy and cruelty of Judeo Christian religions. Alienation from birth religions, and the comparative freedom, self-definition and acceptance in Wicca is a potent combination. On a social level, the Neo-pagan counterculture is a spiritualist successor to various 60's radical movements.

Important elements of Wicca include the worship of a divine marriage- a universal God and Goddess, based largely on the imagery of the Celtic Ceruleans and the Greek Diana. Also important is the value of earth/nature reverence, feminism, and the usage of magick as an aspect of religion. Some adherents use the term Wicca to describe themselves, while some choose to use Neo-pagan and/or Witch.

Though Wicca's link to the British Isles' imagery has faded somewhat in recent years, it remains somewhat distinctive from Nordic Neo-paganism, such as Asatru- which is dealt with seperate.

Paganism is a loose word for the large variety of polytheistic,
shamanic, and mystical non-monotheistic religions. Paganism exists
in all cultures, from paleolithic to technological, but has
historically waxed and waned. The ancient Egyptians are an example of
a highly pagan society; so are the ancient Romans; and all paleolithic
cultures from the Old Stone Age to the present have strong pagan
elements. An example of a less pagan culture would be the West for
the last thousand years or so, since the centuries following the Fall
of Rome. The domination of the Middle East by Christians and Moslem's
has also largely shut out paganism.

Characteristic of paganism is a tolerance for other pagnistic ideas,
even those that literally contradict one's own. Such persecutions as
have been directed against pagan religions by each other are
by-products of political struggles and mass population movements
rather than ideologically motivated. The same is to some extent true
of early Judaism, which was the direct inheritor to the traditions of
a strongly pagan society. A slave revolt apparently led to a few
hundred thousand slaves with no place to live; to get them, they
butchered the inhabitants of pagan cities and took up residence in the
cities themselves. They invoked their war god to justify this action.
Similarly, when the beginnings of the modern Greek mythology were laid
down, it was as a result of invading Northern barbarians supplanting
the earlier (and somewhat geocentric) Titan mythology with their
imported religion, which grew more refined and less aggressive later
on, as happened with Judaism.

Before it came under the thumb of monotheism, the West was dominated
by the highly civilized Roman culture. The Roman Republic and Empire
were characterized by an unusually large number of religions together
in a single social whole, frequently sharing the same geography and
even the same temples. This explicitly eclectic (or "syncretistic",
as it is more usually known in studies of the Romans) synthesis is
more similar to modern neo-paganism than any other form of historical
paganism I know of. However, it ended after the Christian emperors
took over and Rome fell.

The post-pagan West experienced frequent resurgences of paganism in
various forms. If we date this at 1000 CE for convenience, we see
first the Inquisitorial period, where paganism was punished with death
and torture. Then there comes the Renaissance, in which pagan
symbolism and ideas in art and philosophy were somewhat more common
than explicitly Christian ones. The Renaissance lasted until the 16th
century. Note that the Inquisitions lasted effectively until the
Enlightenment period, and were bad during the Renaissance, but ceased
to be mostly ideologically motivated after the first three centuries.
The Inquisition had become a political arm of the Vatican, a force
useful in many ways other than suppressing heresy. It spent much of
its time accomplishing political, anti feminist, and covert goals of
the Church. We see in the trial of the Templars in the fourteenth
century that uncommonly faithful people were caught in a secular
political struggle between the King of France and the Pope. They were
routinely tortured, the usual prompted confessions were given, and
they were executed, for reasons having nothing to do with ideology or
heresy except as excuses.

It is also during the Renaissance that we begin to have evidence of
what we may consider explicitly religious paganism again. Most of the
grimoires we have date from this era; alchemists, often overtly
Christian but employing pagan symbolism and texts, were most common
during the Renaissance; the Kabbalah and Tarot originate in the
Renaissance, forming the backbone of modern pagan symbolism. The
Renaissance also saw the obscure origins of a rebirth, in improved
form, of Greek humanism, technically pagan because of its suppression
by Christian Rome and its use of theistic symbols.

The Reformation was again a less pagan period; Protestant rulers like
Elizabeth and James carried out their own anti-heresy pogroms,
annihilating most evidence of witchcraft. Of particular interest in
the Reformation is Scot's "The Discoverie of Witchcraft", which
presents the humanist and rationalist perspective on witches which has
generally triumphed today: that witch accusations were more often
driven by factors such as ugliness, personal enmity, poverty, and so
forth than on ideological grounds, and that in fact there were no
witches. This is probably true only of the later Inquisitorial
period. Earlier on, the Inquisition certainly did help in the
temporary stamping out of paganism; so if pagans are witches, there
were witches.

We need not bother much with Murray's supposedly anthropological study
of English witchcraft in the Inquisitorial period, except to note that
it has been devoutly accepted by many modern pagans, and to point out
some of its flaws. Based on late Inquisitorial evidence and the
consistency of the confessions obtained by the Inquisitors, and tossing
in some disjointed scraps of English folk history and legend, Murray
asks us to believe that a paleolithic subculture lasted in England,
living semi-naked in the bushes, until nearly the beginning of the
Reformation at least, and possibly until the current day. Of course
late Inquistorial confessions were consistent; they were practically
dictated to the torture victim. A much better account of the
relationship of paganism to Christianity before and during England's
post-pagan period is Jessi Weston's classic "From Ritual to Romance".
Its conclusions were derived from decades of intense study of the
Grail mythology and its anthropological, mythological, and social
context.

As a parting note on the Reformation, we may note the peculiar
phenomenon of court astrologers and alchemists and their ilk, the most
notable examples being the sorcerer John Dee and the seer Edward
Kelley under Elizabeth. These were the inheritors of Paracelsus and
the other alchemists and Christian medicine doctors, using pagan
symbols and methods with a veil of Christian symbolism. Kelley
stopped the work of Dee and Kelley under unknown circumstances; he is
said to have been told by the angels to form a group sex arrangement
with Dee and his wife, which they supposedly did for a while; in
another version, Kelley was driven from the work by a prophecy of a
new age dawning, which was heresy.

So, on to the Enlightenment of the seventeenth century. This was more
humanistic than religious, though humanism is a religion on alternate
Tuesdays; it all depends which of the many reasonable definitions you
use. In any case, the seventeenth centuries saw the first
applications of the renewed Greek humanism that originated in the
Renaissance. The counter-Christian current was running stronger; more
and more, people were beginning to demand equal treatment for all, and
freedom from the rigid boundaries of thought and expression imposed on
them by governments and churches alike. This humanism has colored
most "opposition" religious movements in America since this time, much
for the better in my opinion. This is because principles of respect
for the individual were put into the American system of government (as
an afterthought - the humanistic heyday had ended in the 1780's in
America, and the new would-be ruling class had to be forcibly
reminded), and the governmental structure was such that it was able to
make progress in its understanding of freedom.

this is just part one


Last edited by FIRE on June 26th 2009, 3:45 pm; edited 1 time in total
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What is PAGANISM Part 2

Post by FIRE on June 26th 2009, 3:44 pm

Things did not work out quite so well in France's humanistic
revolution, largely due to Robespierre, the atheistic moral
grandfather of Stalin and Pol Pot. He interpreted opposition to
monarchy as punishing high birth with low death, and then set out
ruthlessly to purge opposition and deviation. Soon monarchy was
re-established in France.

The nineteenth century was a period of resurgence of paganism. The
neo-classical movement was explicitly devoted to rediscovering the
virtues of the highly pagan societies Rome and Greece. This movement
was to be by far the dominant force of the century. Humanism was
further applied to the institution of slavery, resulting in war and
social upheaval. The Prometheans such as Blake, Shelley, Byron, and
so forth were widely considered to be among the greatest luminaries of
the period.

The method of science and its results made available much more
information on religions of the East and of less civilized cultures.
Contact between religiously different but politically equal forces
invariably leads to mutual excuses for the other, largely to help keep
trade going, but also as a result of time spent in foreign climes
observing the practice of religion. This creates, although not in
great numbers at first, a different attitude toward religions than the
dogmatic denial of all other religions possible only under a large and
self-sufficient monolithic theocracy. Other religions are seen as not
neccessarily conflicting with one's own any more than another art
movement does with one's own favorite.

There was a more open resurgence of sorcery in less overtly Christian
forms, particularly in the last half of the century. This attracted
many notable adherents, and from the publication of "The Magus" by
Barrett in 1801, created a magical library in modern English which is
still widely read and used. It used the work of Renaissance
magicians, court sorcerers, Kabalists, and so forth, and attempted to
apply the psychological principles of the day in various original
findings. There was also the Theosophical movement, largely
discredited by Blavatsky's pr oven cheating on tests of psychic powers,
and rather more like spiritualism with Eastern allusions than any
Eastern religion.

The psychical movement, which changed its name to parapsychology, grew
out of spiritualism, which grew out of mesmerism, which was apparently
fairly original and totally ludicrous, but did yield the secret of
hypnotism. This led legitimate investigators to examining the claims
of other groups usually brushed off as mystical. The early Society
for Psychical Research, founded in 1882 and led by prominent
scientists such as the American psychologist William James, was formed
"first, to carry on systematic experimentation with hypnotic subjects,
mediums, clairvoyants, and others; and, secondly, to collect evidence
concerning apparitions, haunted houses, and similar phenomena which
are incidentally reported, but which, from their fugitive nature,
admit of no deliberate control."

It is to be noted that there is still, a century later, no replicable
experiment to demonstrate the existence of anything but hypnotic
subjects in this list. It is also worth noting that while general
models of the layout of the psyche continue to be employed in
psychotherapy, there is still no generally agreed upon experimental
methodology to falsify features of these models. Finally, it should
be noted that the ritual magic methods employed by many pagans, in
other times as well as today, still have not been placed under real
scientific scrutiny to determine whether or not they produce any
physically measurable effects. (My feeling is that such effects are
limited in scope to participants in the rituals and people who have
knowledge of their occurrence, whether such knowledge is true or
false.)

Various factions of magicians struggled to survive in the early half
of the twentieth century, against an increasingly Christian atheist
culture; that is, a materialistic populace considered almost
exclusively with day-to-day life and easy entertainment, but still
paying occasional lip service to Christianity and suspicious of all
other religions. Most of the inheritors of nineteenth-century magical
paganism were hopelessly fragmented and dogmatized, incapable of
working together and resolving their differences.

In the late forties, Gerald Gardner began publishing books on
witchcraft. Gardner was a known associate of Crowley's and his
rituals use a lot of symbolism drawn from Crowley, but only a few
actual references to Crowley. He is also reported to have associated
with Theosophist groups. Crowley was one of the chief inheritors of
the jumble left at the end of the nineteenth century, as well as a
traveller and student in Eastern lands. In any case, Gardner (after
Crowley) called for yet another neo-classicism, following the pattern
of all the other resurgences of Graeco-Roman paganism, but more
explicitly religious.

The laudable looseness of Gardner's system was more attractive to
magically inclined people than the Golden Dawn and Theosophy splinters
remaining. It freed them to create on their own, and they went at it
with a vengeance. One reason for the greater effective freedom was
that Gardner was not as hard an act to follow as many of the Golden
Dawn leaders. He was soon gone beyond by his students, many of whom
went off to form their own Gardnerian splinters and mythological
histories of their origin.

Another reason was the less formidable Gardnerian system of
initiation. Most magical groups had complex multi-layered spiritual
hierarchies. These were supposed to represent psychological fact, but
little in the way of acceptable empirical observation was used to
correct these schemes, mostly drawn from loose interpretations of the
Kaballa, and they can't be said to have really compelling
inter-individual force. These were replaced by a simple hierarchy of
three grades. This was the high-level structure of the Golden Dawn,
and of a number of Masonic groups, which divided their degrees into
categories. The third grade was no longer reserved for secret chiefs
who almost certainly never existed or for mythological prophets, and
the initiations had a more joyful and celebratory character, rather
than a system of awful psychological ordeals. (I feel that the
emphasis on ordeals and spiritual hierarchy was a product of Christian
influence, with the triumph of martyrdom as a supreme spiritual
experience and the hierarchic nature of the Church, and that a simpler
formula based on Thelemic growth, like the dominant neo-pagan formula,
rather than Christian death/rebirth is more appropriate.)

A common claim among neo-pagans is that paganism was suddenly revealed
to the world in the fifties after centuries of hiding. This is
demonstrably false; all that is needed is a bit of history, textual
analysis, and symbolic comparison to see how close neo-paganism (as
the movement came to be known in the sixties) is to its known
historical antecedents. But mythological histories are themselves
traditional in world religions. While it is important to know the
real history of a religion, this does not invalidate the possible
value of mythological tales of the origin, because these serve as
fictional statements of intent, often incorporating powerful
symbolism. They have literary value in this respect; and literary or
other artistic value is a type of spiritual value.

Modern religious paganism has made a unique contribution. No
eclectic/pagan movement of the historical past has brought the
contributions of paleolithic shamanism into the fold as well as has
neo-paganism. In large part this is due to a rise in knowledge of
such religions at the same time as the rise of neo-paganism. This is
an extremely valuable contribution; in shamanic roots of all
human religion. A coven meeting still resembles a GD lodge
considerably more than it does a shamanistic lodge, despite the
valuable addition of techniques originating in shamanistic..

This has been a necessary brief and incomplete account. I have not
mentioned Rabelais, the Rosicrucian's, the decadent poets, Nietzsche,
de Sade, Levi, Gurdjieff, James, Augustine, Shakespeare, Masonry,
Paine, American Utopian communities, Jung, Merlin, art and spirit, or
Gnosticism, all of which are vital elements of the story; I have given
short shrift to the psychical movement and its influence on nineteenth
and twentieth century paganism; and I have neglected many other
relevant topics. But I hope this will suffice as a brief overview of
the pagan history preceding neo-paganism.


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Re: What is PAGANISM Part one

Post by Wind-Dancer on June 26th 2009, 8:19 pm

I thought i knew what paganism was but i was wrong. Your post gave me a clear view of the overall picture. Thanks so much for sharing.

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Re: What is PAGANISM Part one

Post by Spirit-Being on June 27th 2009, 2:07 pm

FIRE wrote:maybe, I the 1st or only pagan here??? So I will share in the hope of enlightening those that don't understand.

Wonderful Post very informative, i really enjoyed reading it and watching the video. I too have not understood what paganism actually was, although in my "spiritual growth" as i like to call it, have come to be more open to many concepts, practices, ideas, & beliefs...

You may actually be the first pagan here, the forum paganism was just added about a week ago. It needed some really good information and i think you have provided that Thank You

As i read your post i felt there was much fear in the minds of the people in some of the organized religions, many had tough times allowing any sort of mystical practices, rituals, and beliefs in their community, that they did not practice themselves. But i do see that even organized religion had their own rituals, practices & beliefs.

I really loved the video, it touched my heart and i felt the Mysticism & Love of the ancient people (Celtics). Through the art and the music, it brought to me a higher understanding it was truly enlightening Meditate

Many Blessings

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Re: What is PAGANISM Part one

Post by Spirit-Being on July 2nd 2009, 12:36 am

I have to say this video (song) speaks to me, i usually listen to songs over and over especially when i truly Love the Vocals. She sings to my soul, my soul is doing leaps of joy Heaven

Many Blessings

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Re: What is PAGANISM Part one

Post by canadianmind on October 10th 2009, 4:59 pm

Very interesting indeed. There are many people who unfortunatly dont actually read up on there religions. Paganism IS the most practiced religion today, almost everyone is unaware of it. There are pagan symbols in almost everything we have, and its in lots of other religions too, especially christian beliefs.

No one person, let alone a whole countries denomination should ever be murdered, or segregeted, or totaly annahlated becasue the main powers in the world "know" that they are right, have any of them really been right? Almost every super power has had a different based religion for the most part ( and i think to be fair though, lots of these religions had many pegan themes and symbolism in their religion).

Now im roman catholic, but that doesnt mean im practicing ( I belive jesus was a real person, but i think he was a very truely enlightened man who died for his beliefs, isnt that a true messiah? even if he wasnt the son of god, any man who dies for his beliefs, and has done so many good things to try to better man, and has his word, no matter how jumbled it may or may not be, is still aroudn today, is a savior or even godly in my eyes).

In all honesty, i belive in practicaly all religions, they all have there good and their bad, but peganism or wicca, seems to hold many more truths then most people would reconise.

Its doesnt matter who is right and who is wrong, but what matters is that we get along and work together to understand ourselves.
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Re: What is PAGANISM Part one

Post by freebie on November 9th 2009, 1:21 pm

Thank you for informing me on paganism and the video was wonderful! I too thought I knew about paganism but come to find out I didn't. I now have a respect for this belief. Thank you again.
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Re: What is PAGANISM Part one

Post by Maggie-May on January 20th 2012, 1:11 pm

Hey Fire, now there are two Pagan's on here.
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Re: What is PAGANISM Part one

Post by sunmystic on January 22nd 2012, 2:21 pm

There was a religion that predated the Druids. This religion was a Nature based religion that worshiped the Mother and this religion was against human and animal sacrifice as a way to appease the gods or heaven is you wish and human and animal sacrifice was considered a sacrilege against the Mother. Because the Druids were into human and animal sacrifice and in power, the older religion had to go into hiding. When the first Christians showed up claiming that Jesus was the final sacrifice and was against the Druids, this earlier religion backed the Christians which resulted in an agreement being made between the Christians and this older religion that worshiped the Mother. The folks of this older religion that worshiped the Mother and were not into animal and human sacrifice were labeled Pagans and they did not come under or be held accountable to church law. And Mother Mary is an important part of the Church because of this older religion helping the early Christians.

Druids were not considered Pagans by anybody, which is why they were hunted to extinction. Those that did not worship the Mother and love and respect nature were not considered Pagans. Later the Protestants and to some extent the Church, begin to label all not Christians of Satan and persecute them. So now in today's world if you are not Christian, then you are a Pagan.
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Re: What is PAGANISM Part one

Post by mia on March 15th 2012, 3:17 pm

need to read this, so answering so I dont lose it xx

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Re: What is PAGANISM Part one

Post by mia on March 15th 2012, 5:48 pm

I have only recently accepted I am Pagan or something very similar, maybe Spiritualist/Pagan if there is such a thing.
I love being outdoors, in the woods, or by the sea, anywhere except indoors.
I have conversations with the trees in my copse, am trying to learn about herbs, the stars and planets.
Gosh, so much I want to learn and understand.
I will be owning my first pentacle on my birthday this year, I never ever thought that would happen!
Maybe I am not a proper pagan, cos as yet I have to see the need for spells, cos my way works just as well, but who knows?
And magic, I do that too without using anything except my mind.
Again, who knows? lol
I know I have lots to learn and understand as yet, but admitting or coming out was a big thing for me ...... only happened a couple of weeks ago.

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Re: What is PAGANISM Part one

Post by sunmystic on March 16th 2012, 8:57 am

mia wrote:I have only recently accepted I am Pagan or something very similar, maybe Spiritualist/Pagan if there is such a thing.
I love being outdoors, in the woods, or by the sea, anywhere except indoors.
I have conversations with the trees in my copse, am trying to learn about herbs, the stars and planets.
Gosh, so much I want to learn and understand.
I will be owning my first pentacle on my birthday this year, I never ever thought that would happen!
Maybe I am not a proper pagan, cos as yet I have to see the need for spells, cos my way works just as well, but who knows?
And magic, I do that too without using anything except my mind.
Again, who knows? lol
I know I have lots to learn and understand as yet, but admitting or coming out was a big thing for me ...... only happened a couple of weeks ago.

Mia, if you have any questions about the ancient magiks, just ask, I have studied them. The first thing that you are going to need along with your pentacle is a "staff". This staff should be from nature and have a personality of it's own. The next thing that you will need is a "nature" wand. A small made by Nature stick or piece of a stick/limb that chooses you. And last, five small stones that also choose you. These small stones are for anchoring your pentacle.
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Re: What is PAGANISM Part one

Post by mia on March 16th 2012, 11:49 am

Wow sunny!
I have been wanting a staff for ages!
I never knew why.
And I already have a 'wand' ready to be decorated, and I have the decorations.
My 'wand' is a twig I picked up from Glastonbury.
Wow, so glad you are here!
Thank you xxxx
synchronicity again Smile

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Re: What is PAGANISM Part one

Post by sunmystic on March 16th 2012, 1:49 pm

mia wrote:Wow sunny!
I have been wanting a staff for ages!
I never knew why.
And I already have a 'wand' ready to be decorated, and I have the decorations.
My 'wand' is a twig I picked up from Glastonbury.
Wow, so glad you are here!
Thank you xxxx
synchronicity again Smile

Mia, you are loved also Smile ! And you do have the instinct for this stuff. If I don't have the answer to one of your questions, then I will go to somebody that does. No problema. And no question is a stupid question Smile . Ok?
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Re: What is PAGANISM Part one

Post by mia on March 16th 2012, 2:07 pm

Well here goes, lol
Thank you xx
What will the 5 stones be for?
And do you mean crystals? as in quartz, citrine etc
Or pebbles?
Or any type?

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Re: What is PAGANISM Part one

Post by sunmystic on March 16th 2012, 5:40 pm

mia wrote:Well here goes, lol
Thank you xx
What will the 5 stones be for?
And do you mean crystals? as in quartz, citrine etc
Or pebbles?
Or any type?

When you draw a pentagram on the ground the five stones are placed at the tips of the five points of the pentacle to ground the pentacle with your magik. When you are on a walkabout certain small stones will call out to you and you will be particularly attracted to them. Those small stones are the Mother's gift to you for your magik. My suggestion would be to collect only five small stones at a time and keep them together as a group, and to not mix any stones from one five stone group with any stones from another five stone group. If you do, then you will kill or lessen the power of the original group. And each five stone group should be kept in a bag or box (traditionally it is a leather bag or a wooden box) that is it's own. It is not about pretty or what kind of stone they are, it is about, "They called to you." And this call is in fives. Six is the beginning of another five stone group. When you set out to work with the ground drawn pentacle one of the several five stone groups that you have collected will call out to you and that is the five stone group that you use for that "working".
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Re: What is PAGANISM Part one

Post by mia on March 16th 2012, 5:53 pm

Aaah, I wondered if it would be for the points of the star.
I practised drawing a pentagram last night and I learnt where each element goes too.

I usually sprinkle my crystals in a circle for me to sit in in my copse.
I spose its a similar thing isnt it

I understand the calling of the stones.

I am finding it a little difficult to change my ways so suddenly.
I cannot get the idea of a God or Goddess in my head.
I always speak to the Universe, or trees, or the moon and stars.

I need to get a book on Paganism .... there are so many though!

I have read things on the internet, not the same as a book one can carry in ones bag though.

What would I be doing when you say;

When you set out to work with the ground drawn pentacle

I sit in my crystal circle to meditate, astral, talk to Merlin, do a rescue, an earth healing ....

Is it the same thing?

I apologise for the randomness, I tend to write as I think.


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Re: What is PAGANISM Part one

Post by sunmystic on March 17th 2012, 4:38 pm

mia wrote:Aaah, I wondered if it would be for the points of the star.
I practised drawing a pentagram last night and I learnt where each element goes too.

I usually sprinkle my crystals in a circle for me to sit in in my copse.
I spose its a similar thing isnt it

I understand the calling of the stones.

I am finding it a little difficult to change my ways so suddenly.
I cannot get the idea of a God or Goddess in my head.
I always speak to the Universe, or trees, or the moon and stars.

I need to get a book on Paganism .... there are so many though!

I have read things on the internet, not the same as a book one can carry in ones bag though.

What would I be doing when you say;

When you set out to work with the ground drawn pentacle

I sit in my crystal circle to meditate, astral, talk to Merlin, do a rescue, an earth healing ....

Is it the same thing?

I apologise for the randomness, I tend to write as I think.


Mia, randomness is great, I do not mind. At all. If one examines pieces of a picture here and there, these pieces eventually come together as a complete picture. Personally, I like random, studying things in a row/in order thwarts my creativity Smile .

Mia, you have created some interesting questions Smile . Humm? The version of Pagan magik that I was trained in was based on a tradition that came from an ancient group of people that lived in Northern Europe that legend calls the "Fae". Apparently Mia, I only studied one side of that tradition. I studied the pentacle side and what is basically called Nature Wizardry. I am being told that that ancient tradition had two sides and that the circle and crystals stuff is the other side of that tradition. The Circle side has the wand but not the staff. The circle side uses only crystals and the pentacle side uses crystals only when they call to you on a walk about as a part of a five calling. The circle side did wear a pentacle, but the pentacle side didn't. They wore a small bag containing a called five of stones. Mia Smile I do not know anything at all about the circle side of of that ancient tradition. So anyway Mia, whatever you have to share with me about the circle side of that tradition I am interested in. I don't know anything about it. Who knew Smile .
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Re: What is PAGANISM Part one

Post by sunmystic on March 17th 2012, 4:46 pm

Oh and apparently when you combine the circle and crystals with the pentacle and stones, you are working both sides the tradition as a union.
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Re: What is PAGANISM Part one

Post by mia on March 17th 2012, 5:09 pm

Gosh this is getting interesting!
It was Merlin who suggested I sit in a circle of crystals and meditate.
So, I have done it ever since.

I do like the idea of using crystals, cos I am used to them.
I would be happy with stones just as much though.

With crystals around you, you feel the energies of them and I like that, it feels more protective.
I have yet to sit in a pentacle,
Methinks it will have an energy of its own Smile

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Re: What is PAGANISM Part one

Post by sunmystic on March 18th 2012, 12:55 pm

mia wrote:Gosh this is getting interesting!
It was Merlin who suggested I sit in a circle of crystals and meditate.
So, I have done it ever since.

I do like the idea of using crystals, cos I am used to them.
I would be happy with stones just as much though.

With crystals around you, you feel the energies of them and I like that, it feels more protective.
I have yet to sit in a pentacle,
Methinks it will have an energy of its own Smile

Circles, crystals, wands, and candles are the female/spirit side of the tradition. Pentacles, stones, and staffs are the male/physical side of the tradition. And Merlin is a master of the circle side of the tradition. "Methinks" is correct Smile and it is my feeling Mia that you are not going to be comfortable sitting in a pentacle. Pentacle energy is a bit wide open and confrontational. Kind of a "chest thumping" reality. Adding the circle and crystals around the outside of it does soften things a bit which you might find more comfortable. Also you could place the "circle with crystals" in the center of the "pentacle with stones". I think that doing it that way you would find it a lot of fun. The pentacle by itself is not protective, but Smile placing the circle in the center of the pentacle would be protective and act to filter the male side energy of the pentacle. The spirit body inside of the physical body.
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Re: What is PAGANISM Part one

Post by mia on March 18th 2012, 2:19 pm

I will try all the ways.
I am not afraid of energy.
If I don't like it I can change the next time.
I love experimenting.

Gosh its like learning French at school, with the male and female things lol

I am copying and saving bits you post which I cant remember lol

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Re: What is PAGANISM Part one

Post by Spirit-Being on March 18th 2012, 6:57 pm

Very Interesting Rain

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Re: What is PAGANISM Part one

Post by sunmystic on March 19th 2012, 2:03 pm

mia wrote:I will try all the ways.
I am not afraid of energy.
If I don't like it I can change the next time.
I love experimenting.

Gosh its like learning French at school, with the male and female things lol

I am copying and saving bits you post which I cant remember lol

I agree with Spirit-Being that it is very interesting, and I have learned things from you Mia that I did not know.
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Re: What is PAGANISM Part one

Post by mia on March 19th 2012, 2:10 pm


I agree with Spirit-Being that it is very interesting, and I have learned things from you Mia that I did not know.

And I have learnt lots from you I did not know.
I could have researched.
I much prefer to speak to someone who has knowledge, ask questions, converse.
We all learn from one another xxx

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